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Chatham County Online => Chatham County Online => Topic started by: Wilderness Voice on August 14, 2017, 07:41:20 PM



Title: is the Pittsboro statue is next ~ rumors swirl its coming down tonight??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 14, 2017, 07:41:20 PM
www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmv6TPNnYXU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmv6TPNnYXU#)

Durham Protestors just tore down a Confederate statue on public property.  The girl in the video should sing up for Glow Wresting with all this fake pushes and kicks to a metal statue ~ chuckle


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: John Florida on August 15, 2017, 06:47:19 PM
  Taking that statue down makes it all better. The war didn't happen and it's not history.  Idiots.


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: 1911A on August 16, 2017, 12:37:48 AM
Over my dead body.  And that ain't happening, so ..............


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Silk_Hope on August 16, 2017, 07:41:44 AM
Barry Hayes stated on the local news that Randy Voller spoke to the Pittsboro Town Board requesting the monument be removed.

In the end if all of the monuments are removed what has been accomplished? Has history changed?


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Ice Pilot2 on August 16, 2017, 09:48:19 AM
Barry Hayes stated on the local news that Randy Voller spoke to the Pittsboro Town Board requesting the monument be removed.

In the end if all of the monuments are removed what has been accomplished? Has history changed?



When did  Voller do that?    I know there are many folks that have voiced they want it down.   And now Gov. Cooper is supporting all of them be removed.

http://docsouth.unc.edu/commland/monument/11/ (http://docsouth.unc.edu/commland/monument/11/)

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/north-carolina-governor-roy-cooper-confederate-monuments-should-come-down/article/2631658 (http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/north-carolina-governor-roy-cooper-confederate-monuments-should-come-down/article/2631658)


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Pi on August 16, 2017, 11:00:57 AM
Barry Hayes stated on the local news that Randy Voller spoke to the Pittsboro Town Board requesting the monument be removed.

In the end if all of the monuments are removed what has been accomplished? Has history changed?



When did  Voller do that?    I know there are many folks that have voiced they want it down.   And now Gov. Cooper is supporting all of them be removed.

[url]http://docsouth.unc.edu/commland/monument/11/[/url] ([url]http://docsouth.unc.edu/commland/monument/11/[/url])

[url]http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/north-carolina-governor-roy-cooper-confederate-monuments-should-come-down/article/2631658[/url] ([url]http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/north-carolina-governor-roy-cooper-confederate-monuments-should-come-down/article/2631658[/url])


Is it really that many?  Or is it actually a very small group of extremely vocal people?

People like Voller and Cooper see this as a wedge issue.  An easy way of scoring points with like minded people.  But lest they forget, those monuments don't represent slavery or the practice thereof.

Those are memorials for fallen soldiers.  Some might call them traitors, but the fact is they were soldiers much like those that have fought in every war before or since.  Many of them were young men, and the vast, vast majority of them never owned another human being.  They were simply poor farmers or tradesman who answered the call to (in their view) defend their home.

I'm from Western NC and my ancestors fought on both sides.  And I don't mean to say that some were from the North and some from the South.  They were all born and raised in the Appalachian mountains.  They just happened to fall on different sides for various reasons.

Those monuments aren't there to honor rich plantation owners who supported the abhorrent practice of slavery.  They are there to honor the poor, likely illiterate, fellow who felt it was his duty to serve his state.

What purpose is served by tearing down a monument that is really there to honor the sacrifice of human life?  Doesn't the monument say something along the lines of "Our Fallen Heroes"?

This perplexes me about as much as the people who didn't want the 9/11 memorial. 


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: John Florida on August 16, 2017, 11:48:22 AM
  I see it as having to deal with the perpetually offended if all the statues were gone it would be something else for ever.


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Ice Pilot2 on August 16, 2017, 12:02:48 PM
Barry Hayes stated on the local news that Randy Voller spoke to the Pittsboro Town Board requesting the monument be removed.

In the end if all of the monuments are removed what has been accomplished? Has history changed?



When did  Voller do that?    I know there are many  some folks that have voiced they want it down.   And now Gov. Cooper is supporting all of them be removed.

[url]http://docsouth.unc.edu/commland/monument/11/[/url] ([url]http://docsouth.unc.edu/commland/monument/11/[/url])

[url]http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/north-carolina-governor-roy-cooper-confederate-monuments-should-come-down/article/2631658[/url] ([url]http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/north-carolina-governor-roy-cooper-confederate-monuments-should-come-down/article/2631658[/url])


Is it really that many?  Or is it actually a very small group of extremely vocal people?



Have no idea about the number.  I should have used the word "some" instead of "many" -  my bad.       


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: wolfpat on August 16, 2017, 02:01:39 PM
People need to understand that those young soldiers were fighting for their countries. Their country was NOT the Confederate States of America. It was North Carolina or Mississippi or Louisiana or Georgia, etc.

Before that war, The United States was not one thing. It was a collection of things. It was only after the Confederacy lost the war that it was one thing.


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 16, 2017, 02:14:51 PM
(http://www.gopusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/takiyah_thompson.jpg)

Organizer arrested

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/article167371107.html (http://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/article167371107.html)

4th suspect arrested

http://abc11.com/2313763/ (http://abc11.com/2313763/)


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 16, 2017, 02:20:55 PM
This is why President Trump calls it FAKE NEWS ~

www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgtxrCD9iCk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgtxrCD9iCk)


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: 1911A on August 16, 2017, 04:19:32 PM
There's a NC state law protecting these monuments.


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: John Florida on August 16, 2017, 05:35:44 PM
  Make them pay for it besides going to jail.


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 16, 2017, 10:32:26 PM
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/20799876_10210043159971181_198816399912783925_n.jpg?oh=f02f6cc22982bddfd37d7705ef20a8bf&oe=5A1E9B35)

Now the left is threatening to dig up Confederate Generals corpuses

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3173456/Vigilante-protesters-start-DIGGING-body-Confederate-general-Nathan-Forrest-KKK-leader-grave.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3173456/Vigilante-protesters-start-DIGGING-body-Confederate-general-Nathan-Forrest-KKK-leader-grave.html)


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 16, 2017, 10:55:20 PM
(http://www.therightscoop.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/lenin_statue_large.jpg)

Vladimir Lenin MURDERED by STARVATION 5 million Ukrainians in just one year and many, many more later. Yet, his bronze statue stands boldly, in tribute to him in Fremont (Seattle area), Washington.
Why is this genocidal father of Communism not offensive but Robert E. Lee's is?


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 16, 2017, 11:15:56 PM
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/20819430_10210043275174061_727291870431473177_o.jpg?oh=b1ac194081887261ce1f941cedbcc9be&oe=5A3832A0)

If this offends you, please send to me


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 17, 2017, 03:24:49 PM
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/20914268_10210047628002879_2724755660824740891_n.jpg?oh=196933401d4407cc292ac6ca924b9e77&oe=5A37AD4B)

Now their torching Abe monuments in Chicago last night

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/aug/17/abraham-lincoln-monument-torched-in-chicago-an-abs/ (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/aug/17/abraham-lincoln-monument-torched-in-chicago-an-abs/)


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 17, 2017, 07:21:30 PM
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/20841764_10210048879554167_1720481896434473484_n.jpg?oh=57eea1c79403ebb4ec890b04e78ff260&oe=5A1C9FBB)

Locals guarding Confederate statue in downtown Pittsboro, rummers/tip claiming its coming down tonight??tonight


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next ~ rumors swirl its coming down tonight??
Post by: acorn on August 17, 2017, 07:36:10 PM
There are too many things to respond to in this thread to do the quote thing. So I'm doing them in order that things were posted here.

1) Up front, I don't support vandalism or people taking it on themselves to destroy these monuments. But it doesn't mean I support some of the statements made further down this thread.

2) I was at the Town Board meeting when Randy Voller spoke during the public expression/citizen's matters part (if not familiar, you have to sign up and can't speak about items on that night's agenda). What I heard was him saying was that it was time to start that conversation and maybe it could be moved somewhere. (Before you jump in, more re that below.)

3) Re a lot of comments here: OUR monument here may have a soldier on top but go look at it, it memorializes the confederacy, not fallen soldiers. Right at the top it says "CSA 1861-1865" and it wasn't erected until 1907, it is not a traditional war memorial that lists or even mentions the dead. Elsewhere there's a mention of CSA fighters. It was erected by the Daughters of the Confederacy who were also responsible for ensuring that schoolbooks taught a very slanted history.

4) Yes, in 2015 the NC General Assembly passed a state law, though it would take a lawyer to figure out what could be allowed or not allowed for Pittsboro's giant granite column and tin soldier on top (he may be solid, he may be hollow).

5) The Daily Mail is not a reliable newspaper in my experience. Doesn't mean everything they print is wrong though. However, the moonie paper the Washington Times is notorious.

6) Yeah I'm pretty surprised there's a statue of Lenin in Fremont CA. However, I am pretty sure it was Stalin, not Lenin that was responsible for that man-made famine in Ukraine. (Don't you just love Google.)

7) So who started the rumor. Of course there was an article in the Chatham Record which shouldn't have alarmed people to the extent of rushing to "defend the statue." I saw no-one there this afternoon and thought thank god, and the last thing we need is for out of town crazies to come in, especially with it being not in a park but so close to a busy road.

So to scotch that rumor (and please help get that out there), because of state law it can't just be taken down suddenly overnight. Secondly, in addition to needing a crane, it would require blocking the road, diverting traffic, police and a lot of prior permission for all that. And I don't think either the Town or County Boards are in any rush to do that.


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: Axiomatic on August 17, 2017, 09:07:35 PM
There's a NC state law protecting these monuments.

Who needs laws when you gots feeeeeeelings?!


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next ~ rumors swirl its coming down tonight??
Post by: Pi on August 17, 2017, 09:08:00 PM
Re a lot of comments here: OUR monument here may have a soldier on top but go look at it, it memorializes the confederacy, not fallen soldiers. Right at the top it says "CSA 1861-1865" and it wasn't erected until 1907, it is not a traditional war memorial that lists or even mentions the dead. Elsewhere there's a mention of CSA fighters. It was erected by the Daughters of the Confederacy who were also responsible for ensuring that schoolbooks taught a very slanted history.


It's obviously referring to those who fought and those who died.  Does it just say "Confederate soldiers that survived"?  No?  Then it is a memorial to those who fought and or died.  

You're leaving out a very important fact that I shall remind you of.  In 1958, Congress passed a law such that Confederate soldiers are to be treated the same as Union soldiers.  Thus, for all intents and purposes, they are both American soldiers.

Yeah I'm pretty surprised there's a statue of Lenin in Fremont CA. However, I am pretty sure it was Stalin, not Lenin that was responsible for that man-made famine in Ukraine. (Don't you just love Google.)


If you love Google so much, then perhaps you should actually use it before you speak of things you don't understand. "Pretty sure" doesn't cut it.  Pay special attention to number 4.
http://econfaculty.gmu.edu/bcaplan/museum/comfaq.htm#part4 (http://econfaculty.gmu.edu/bcaplan/museum/comfaq.htm#part4)

Lenin was such a nice guy, right?  I mean it was Stalin who famously said "Let the peasants starve!".  Oh wait...

So who started the rumor. Of course there was an article in the Chatham Record which shouldn't have alarmed people to the extent of rushing to "defend the statue." I saw no-one there this afternoon and thought thank god, and the last thing we need is for out of town crazies to come in, especially with it being not in a park but so close to a busy road.


Those look like locals to me standing out there.  They're out there right now as a matter of fact.  The crazies are the ones that are bent on destroying the memorial.  And despite your machinations to the contrary, it is a memorial.  For American soldiers.


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next ~ rumors swirl its coming down tonight??
Post by: 1911A on August 17, 2017, 09:40:14 PM
Quote
... because of state law it can't just be taken down suddenly overnight. Secondly, in addition to needing a crane, it would require blocking the road, diverting traffic, police and a lot of prior permission for all that.

Nevertheless, it didn't stop the a-holes in Durham from desecrating the monument there.

You want to help bring the current unsanity to Pittsboro?  I'm advising you and your cohorts to back off or people will get hurt, and that will be on you.


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next??
Post by: John Florida on August 17, 2017, 10:01:14 PM
([url]https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/20914268_10210047628002879_2724755660824740891_n.jpg?oh=196933401d4407cc292ac6ca924b9e77&oe=5A37AD4B[/url])

Now their torching Abe monuments in Chicago last night

[url]http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/aug/17/abraham-lincoln-monument-torched-in-chicago-an-abs/[/url] ([url]http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/aug/17/abraham-lincoln-monument-torched-in-chicago-an-abs/[/url])



 Lincoln must have been a slave owner. Never would have Thunk it.


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next ~ rumors swirl its coming down tonight??
Post by: acorn on August 17, 2017, 10:49:42 PM

You want to help bring the current unsanity to Pittsboro?  I'm advising you and your cohorts to back off or people will get hurt, and that will be on you.


Are you nuts, that is exactly what I DON'T want. And I don't have cohorts either. Apparently there's a radio station you can't say that about. Anyhow, I am not going to stay up and argue with you if you don't believe and don't understand what I wrote.


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next ~ rumors swirl its coming down tonight??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 18, 2017, 12:14:17 AM
I always thought they were memorials for the southern soldiers that fought and died in the war and both Union and Confederate soldiers were both are considered US Veterans

It’s true that Union and Confederate soldiers are considered U.S. veterans under federal law, and that they would be entitled to the same benefits as Union soldiers today.

These claims went viral on social media after the Confederate flag was removed from the South Carolina Capitol grounds in July 2015. The state legislature voted to remove the flag after a self-described white supremacist murdered nine black churchgoers there.

That inspired posts on social media sites that claimed Confederate and Union veterans were considered equals under federal law, and that they are entitled to the same protections and benefits.

It’s true that a federal law passed in 1958 listed the spouses and children of all Civil War veterans — Confederate and Union — as eligible for federal pensions:

Whenever there is no surviving spouse entitled to pension under section 1532 of this title, the Secretary shall pay to the children of each Civil War veteran who met the service requirements of section 1532 of this title a pension at the monthly rate of $73.13 for one child, plus $8.13 for each additional child, with the total amount equally divided.

It’s also true that federal law (formerly Public Law 810) makes Confederate soldiers eligible for burial in national cemeteries and for taxpayer-funded headstones, just like Union soldiers:

The Secretary shall furnish, when requested, an appropriate memorial headstone or marker for the purpose of commemorating an eligible individual whose remains are unavailable. Such a headstone or marker shall be furnished for placement in a national cemetery area reserved for that purpose under section 2403 of this title, a veterans’ cemetery owned by a State, or, in the case of a veteran, in a State, local, or private cemetery.

The last known Civil War veteran died in 1956, and the last known widow of a Civil War veteran died in 2003 at age 93. But there were surprisingly two children of Civil War veterans who were still receiving benefits in 2012, U.S. News reports:

In the 19th and early 20th centuries, only Union soldiers were eligible for military benefits. It wasn’t until the 1930s that confederate soldiers began receiving pensions from the federal government. Prior to that, confederate soldiers could apply for benefits through the state they resided in.

The groundwork for reconciliation, however, was laid decades before Confederate soldiers and family members became available for federal benefits.

President William McKinley cited reconciliation between the North and South in a speech that followed the conclusion of the Spanish American War on December 14, 1898. A number of former Confederate officers had volunteered for service during the war, which had helped secure U.S. victory, McKinley said:

… Every soldier’s grave made during our unfortunate Civil War is a tribute to American valor. And while, when those graves were made, we differed widely about the future of this government, those differences were long ago settled by the arbitrament of arms; and the time has now come, in the evolution of sentiment and feeling under the providence of God, when in the spirit of fraternity we should share with you in the care of the graves of the Confederate soldiers.

The Cordial feeling now happily existing between the North and South prompts this gracious act, and if it needed further justification, it is found in the gallant loyalty to the Union and the flag so conspicuously shown in the year just past by the sons and grandsons of these (Spanish American War veterans).

What a glorious future awaits us if united, wisely, and bravely we face the new problems now pressing upon us, determined to solve them for right and humanity.

That flag has been planted in two hemispheres, and there it remains the symbol of liberty and law, of peace and progress. Who will withdraw from the people over whom it floats its protecting folds? Who will haul it down? Answer me, ye men of the South, who is there in Dixie who will haul it down?

McKinley called for federal recognition of Union and Confederate soldiers because he viewed them all as Americans. But the Confederate flag wasn’t a part of McKinley’s reconciliation efforts, and he specifically cites the flying of the American flag in the south as reason to move forward with federal recognition of Confederate soldiers.

The Confederate flag didn’t fly widely in the south until the 1940s, the Atlantic reports:

After the surrender in 1865, Confederate flags were folded and put away. They were most likely to be spotted at memorials or cemeteries. Even after the hopeful decade of Reconstruction gave way to the violent repression of Redemption, open displays of the flag remained rare. There was no need for a banner to signal defiance; Jim Crow reigned unchallenged.

The flag slowly crept back into public life over the ensuing decades, saluted at veterans’ reunions, promoted by the United Daughters of the Confederacy, even carried into battle by units from the South. By the mid-twentieth century, the flags were also waved by football fans, and sold to tourists.

But as a political symbol, the flag was revived when northern Democrats began to press for an end to the South’s system of racial oppression. In 1948, the Dixiecrats revolted against President Harry Truman—who had desegregated the armed forces and supported anti-lynching bills. The movement began in Mississippi in February of 1948, with thousands of activists “shouting rebel yells and waving the Confederate flag,” as the Associated Press reported at the time. Some actually removed old, mothballed flags from the trunks where they had until then been gathering dust.

So, it’s true that Confederate and Union soldiers are considered equal under federal law, but critics argue that the same isn’t true of the American and Confederate flags.


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next ~ rumors swirl its coming down tonight??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 18, 2017, 12:24:31 AM
We are not fools though, the left will never be content as the socialist ideology will never stop.  Even if all the status come down, it will never be enough.  I believe this will be the new norm for our national I've seen in many counties around the world ~ protest will be everywhere, even in China and Egypt is a routine event weekly to daily.  Welcome to the new world order 


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next ~ rumors swirl its coming down tonight??
Post by: IrishAle on August 18, 2017, 11:34:40 AM
There seems to be a push to move all "Confederate" statues and memorials and place them in museums.   I feel that it is important to realize that the Chatham Historical Museum is, in fact, in the very courthouse that this statue is in front of.  Now, I'm no expert on moving such things, but I believe it would be a very difficult, if not impossible task to move this statue into the museum itself.... which would put it about as close to being in a museum as it could be in Chatham already.



Title: Horse manure: USC Mascot in the gun sights of the history scrubbers
Post by: 1911A on August 20, 2017, 11:16:48 AM
It's a horse, an all-white horse, his name is Traveler VII, he's the mascot for USC's team The Trojans and 

Quote
... Saphia Jackson, co-director of the USC Black Student Assembly, asked students not to be quiet, and reminded that “white supremacy hits close to home” and referenced the name of the Trojans mascot.

...  questions about the name’s provenance have increased on social media in the midst of the national discussion on race.

We're not having a "national discussion on race"; we're witnessing mass unsanity.

So, I echo the words of President Donald J. Trump and ask "where does it stop?"





Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next ~ rumors swirl its coming down tonight??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 23, 2017, 10:58:33 PM
(https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/20746276_10156463395052598_1161003380428907959_o.jpg?oh=11af1f3946f89d4d8d26f39a6d8a24e2&oe=5A2F31BB)


Title: Re: is the Pittsboro statue is next ~ rumors swirl its coming down tonight??
Post by: Wilderness Voice on August 29, 2017, 01:21:07 PM
www.youtube.com/watch?v=gm3U39lnPO0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gm3U39lnPO0)

Good insight from John MacArthur on a Bibical response