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Author Topic: Of Double Standards  (Read 4193 times)
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Axiomatic
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« Reply #15 on: June 07, 2013, 12:24:27 AM »

Stopping by to say hey, or getting into a long discussion are two different things.

Pretty soon you guys will all just be able to agree with each other anyway.

NCYippie hasn't been here since this last post (at least under that name).

And here I thought someone had just opened a window...
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« Reply #16 on: June 17, 2013, 02:52:04 PM »

Stopping by to say hey, or getting into a long discussion are two different things.

Pretty soon you guys will all just be able to agree with each other anyway.

NCYippie hasn't been here since this last post (at least under that name).

And here I thought someone had just opened a window...


  He's MIA??
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Pi
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« Reply #17 on: June 17, 2013, 06:32:39 PM »

I'm surprised he didn't give up a long time ago.  It was exceedingly rare for him to be able to hold his own on a given topic.  Most of the time we disagreed I tied him up with a bow, assuming it was a topic I participated in.

Now that the Obama administration has jumped the shark, how is he supposed to defend that?  The short answer it:  no one can really defend what the current administration is doing.  It is much easier to simply not participate than it is to defend what isn't defensible. 

All that said, I enjoyed debating with him even if he was hypocritical at times and probably a heck of a lot more partisan than he let on.  It is hard for some people to admit they were wrong.  I've got friends of mine that voted for Obama and they are downright ashamed of themselves for it.

If there is any consolation to the NC Yippies of the world, it is this: the Republicans are a bunch of bumbling idiots that couldn't find their rear end if you rammed it full or radium and gave them a Geiger counter, a map, and Karl Freakin Rove as a consultant.  They can be secure in the knowledge that some of the draconian laws we're fighting against now were originally installed by the former administration via the Patriot Act.

Even in the worst of times, when all looks bleak for the left wing authoritarians, there is a light in the tunnel.  Republicans just can't stop handing them victories, whether it is "immigration reform" or defending spying on EVERYONE.  They can all feel secure knowing that people like Mr. Graham of SC, McCain, and the rest of the Republican cadre love nothing more than big government.

The double standard that hits home so hard is not the individual ones we see here on the board.  It is the movers and the shakers in each of the parties, whether it be Biden with his comments about spying in 2006, only to have a complete 180 while in office.  Or the multitudes of Republicans who touted the Patriot Act and told us how important it was when it came to fighting terror.  Thus, people can't say "McCain is a RINO".  That just doesn't fit.  They are LEADING the Republican party.  They ARE the Republicans.  It is the conservatives and libertarian leaning conservatives that hold views counter to most of the party.  The Rand Paul's of the party are not in control.  Nor are they as fundamentally consistent as we'd like them to be.

Back to the topic of the BBS, even if the two boards were merged, we'd still wish for the Yipster's participation.  Have you been over to that board?  There's nobody over there able to hold a candle even to Mr. Yippie.  At any rate, assuming we can get through this Obama term with our sanity, you'll see that my stance will remain the same.  And what will happen when the worm turns and a Republican is in place, championing the same policies?  I guess then I get to mix it up with the home team.  The hilarious part is that some of them will have the gall to tell me I've changed sides.
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Axiomatic
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« Reply #18 on: June 17, 2013, 06:51:31 PM »

I suspect that is why so many others have gone quiet - or gone away: despite their allegiance to the party they are embarrassed by their "leader" and prefer not to entertain guilt by association. The simple truth is that things like the IRS scandal directly affect only right-wingers, but indirectly corruption touches everyone.

The murders at Benghazi sully the reputations of every American and every American should be demanding answers and accountability. One of the prime architects - hillary clinton - is right there in the middle of it and needs to be taken to task for her fecklessness, dishonesty, and cowardice.

The NSA spygate isn't illegal as far as I can tell but it is bad policy and should be leaving a bad taste in everyone's mouth - not just partisans. Unfortunately what we're seeing is just more "whose ox got gored?" cr*p.

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Pi
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« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2013, 07:41:30 PM »

The NSA spygate isn't illegal as far as I can tell

I say it is illegal because it goes against the constitution.  If we consider the 4th amendment (and I will just be lazy and cut and paste what I saw on another forum)

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

We're supposed to be secure in our papers and effects. Email and telephone conversations are the modern equivalent of that type of correspondence. Note that it says "unreasonable searches". Reason should imple probably cause. Blanket surveillance and retention of that data is conducted, by definition, at large. What probable cause is referenced within that current practice? None.

It isn't for the government to know what I say in an email. Just because the technology exists that makes it possible to have all my conversations, it doesn't mean it gives them the right to do so. The reason the founders put that in place was to protect us from the abuses that this practice might lead to.

Some people may disagree and feel that the government can do whatever it likes, but to me, this constitutes a search without probably cause, which is a violation of my constitutional rights. It isn't that I'm trying to hide anything. It's just the principle. When it comes to oversight, as citizens we're supposed to be diligent and make sure that we elect people that also hold our rights dear. If we don't know the abuses are going on, there's no way for us to know we need to react via the ballot box.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2013, 07:43:20 PM by Pi » Logged

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« Reply #20 on: June 17, 2013, 08:26:43 PM »

Quote
I say it is illegal because it goes against the constitution.  If we consider the 4th amendment (and I will just be lazy and cut and paste what I saw on another forum)

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

We're supposed to be secure in our papers and effects. Email and telephone conversations are the modern equivalent of that type of correspondence.

Agreed.

Furthermore, it can be argued, and it has been, that much of our new type "correspondence" doesn't belong to us individually due to its format/method of transmission, BUT, it doesn't hold that it belongs to the government, then, by default; it's the property of the telecoms/hosts et al.
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« Reply #21 on: June 17, 2013, 10:39:10 PM »

I'm not so sure about that either.  Think of it this way: the US Mail carries our letters back and forth.  But even though they are transporting one person's property (correspondence is property) from one place to another doesn't mean that they own it.  Likewise, an internet provider provides a service.  Any intellectual property I convey via the web doesn't belong to my service provider.  Neither does my correspondence.
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« Reply #22 on: June 18, 2013, 06:57:24 AM »

I'm not so sure about that either.  Think of it this way: the US Mail carries our letters back and forth.  But even though they are transporting one person's property (correspondence is property) from one place to another doesn't mean that they own it.  Likewise, an internet provider provides a service.  Any intellectual property I convey via the web doesn't belong to my service provider.  Neither does my correspondence.

I understand your doubt and acknowledge the analogy.  I do wonder about the terms of service with so many providers, with an emphasis on the mice-type disclosures regarding how much privacy and control is relinquished over one's data, however. 

Notwithstanding, my point is if there is an argument to be made over exactly whom owns the information, one entity definitely NOT in play is the government, therefore some *body's* 4th Amendment rights have been violated.

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Jeff G
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« Reply #23 on: June 22, 2013, 12:49:52 PM »

I hope that NC Yippie will eventually find his way back to the forum here. Otherwise, he will be sorely missed by some folks, including me.

Regarding double standards, the current political climate revolving around this administration, and congress, is no different from most any past administration or congress. For far too long now, we simply do NOT have representation from our elected officials. Just one out of a multitude of examples is found in the video clip at following link:

https://content.bitsontherun.com/previews/n9V24Ey1
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Axiomatic
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« Reply #24 on: June 22, 2013, 04:23:53 PM »

I hope that NC Yippie will eventually find his way back to the forum here. Otherwise, he will be sorely missed by some folks, including me.

Regarding double standards, the current political climate revolving around this administration, and congress, is no different from most any past administration or congress. For far too long now, we simply do NOT have representation from our elected officials. Just one out of a multitude of examples is found in the video clip at following link:

https://content.bitsontherun.com/previews/n9V24Ey1

His ego won't allow him to stay away.
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chrstnhsbndfthr
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« Reply #25 on: June 22, 2013, 07:58:10 PM »

I hope that NC Yippie will eventually find his way back to the forum here. Otherwise, he will be sorely missed by some folks, including me.

Regarding double standards, the current political climate revolving around this administration, and congress, is no different from most any past administration or congress. For far too long now, we simply do NOT have representation from our elected officials. Just one out of a multitude of examples is found in the video clip at following link:

https://content.bitsontherun.com/previews/n9V24Ey1


His ego won't allow him to stay away.

On a personal level, sure, I miss him. On a reality point, just substitute the leftist talking point of the day and you will miss no substance.
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« Reply #26 on: June 23, 2013, 01:00:39 PM »

Just enjoying life and some travels at the moment, will return at some point.










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John Florida
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« Reply #27 on: June 23, 2013, 02:27:15 PM »

Just enjoying life and some travels at the moment, will return at some point.












 Glad to know that your health is good.
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Pi
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« Reply #28 on: June 24, 2013, 11:04:29 AM »

Just enjoying life and some travels at the moment, will return at some point.

Maybe.  Or maybe even you recognize that carrying the torch for the Obama Administration these days is particularly difficult.  The same goes for local and state politics, since Voller has turned out not to be the great guy you thought he was.  I tried to tell you, but you wouldn't listen.

So run away and enjoy the sunshine and then when the news cycle has changed and things have cooled off a bit, come right on back and pick up the same song, same verse, same tune, and just keep right on going.

Until that time, I'm still waiting for you to respond to this:

Why is it that you can take several days and not respond to threads but if the rest of us wait 72 hours, we're purposely ignoring something?  At the very least, you ought to acknowledge that double standard.  I'm not trying to play gotcha just for the sake of playing gotcha.  What I would like is for you to admit you weren't exactly being fair in your previous accusations.  If one standard applies to us with regard to responsiveness, then it must apply to you as well.  Otherwise, we're not operating under principles.  We're operating under partisanship.  Do you finally see where I'm coming from or not?  And don't just say "Sure".  After the fit you threw you can spare a little more than that.

You're hiding out.  I think you are perfectly fine with the executive branch using the IRS as a political weapon.  I think anything that hurts the right is A-OK with you, the ends justify the means, etc.  I think your absence right now is proof that you are not capable of towing the party line right now.  Even in the best of times, it is difficult for you.  Now, you are forced to recognize that it is impossible.

If you think I'm going to give you a break just because you're running away, you are sadly mistaken.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2013, 11:09:35 AM by Pi » Logged

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« Reply #29 on: July 09, 2013, 04:07:36 PM »

just wanted you to know I just had to copy that quote from Hitler that is in the bottom of your posts..put it in my signature...people had better WAKE UP...too much complacency...
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